Missy
Not Quite...
Don't Cry Because It's Over, Smile Because It Happened. ~<3
Posts: 47
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Post by Missy on Aug 16, 2010 16:02:08 GMT -5
The only pairing I support in a romantic way is Astrid/Hiccup, but I have to admit, Toothless/Hiccup is one of the most adorable friendship pairings I've ever seen. <3 It's sweet, touching, just plain adorable. I also loved Hiccup's relationship with his dad, and Ruffnut and Tuffnut's brother/sister relationship. XD
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fez
Viking
fezes are cool
Posts: 65
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Post by fez on Dec 31, 2010 6:15:25 GMT -5
Astrid and Hiccup is the only couple I support romantically as well, (but I do have some couples I like the idea of, but they don't include Astrid and Hiccup). I rarely support movies couples, but astrid and hiccup had such a sweet chemistry, I couldn't help but love it. I've always loved the unrequited, but obvious endgame couples. So not surprisingly I immediately loved them. I really hope that the tv series delves more into their relationship. It will be incredibly sweet I'm sure. I also love the idea of Hiccup pinning over Astrid ever since they were young. My second favorite relationships are Hiccup/Toothless and Ruffnut/Tuffnut. I am also glad at the lack of romantic!Rutnut. But we aren't dealing with the manga fandom, are we? Plus taller girl/shorter boy is always automatic win for me I'm also working on an Astrid x Hiccup forum, not that it's particularly necessary... but, who knows, with how much they're going to milk the series. XD We can tell Dit. Personally, I always love me some same gender pairings. .... I guess that's why I like TuffxHiccup and RuffxAstrid. DON'T JUDGE ME. I actually like most all the pairings. JUST LIKE WITH ABOUT EVERY OTHER FANDOM I BELONG TO. I love yaoi pairings to, the only time I get annoyed is when I see people who like Yaoi at the expense of their abnormal hatred of the female characters. For no good reason except jealousy. Or when the males absolutely hate each-other, which is quite often. But fannon is usually amazing, and I just love me some cannon to. Except for the strange yaoi, and there's a lot of weird ones lol.
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Post by Hookfang on Sept 6, 2012 17:52:24 GMT -5
That's right, I'm posting in a thread that's been dead for two years. (Sorry, don't hurt me.)
I ship Snotlout with Tuffnut, because everyone always ships him with Ruffnut and I didn't want Tuff to be left out.
I also ship Toothless/Stormfly, because I already ship their owners together, so why not?
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Post by nordicviking on Sept 28, 2012 14:28:31 GMT -5
Hiccstrid FTW. And I like RuffXTuff in like a brother sister type love.
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Post by Berk on Dec 6, 2012 0:49:08 GMT -5
Hm...
With regards to the yaoi aspect, I've kind of taken it as a sort of "I think Hiccup would be open to it if such happened, but as it goes his love happens to be a girl" ______
I'm a fan of the Astrid x Hiccup pairing. With regards to Astrid's development in the first movie, I've always taken it more as:
-In the beginning she really didn't have much romantic interest. She was fiercely focused on becoming a great warrior. Her dream. There was Snotlout trying to impress her, but he was just annoying. As for Hiccup, well, he's just that awkward blacksmith's apprentice. No time for him. When Hiccup was in dragon training, he was just that annoying weak kid who was sometimes in the way.
-After Hiccup started to become notable, she was annoyed with him. As a competitor. "I've been focusing my whole life training to be awesome and all of the sudden -this- guy is getting all the glory?" And maybe, possibly, with that, the beginnings of an admiration. Of an opponent for one. And maybe of him. But she was still very much in the "be the ultimate warrior" mindframe.
-And I think the final turning point was the Dragon Ride. It snapped her out being over-focused on her competitiveness and snapped her dragons-must-die mindset. And she began to see Hiccup as well... the awesome person that he is. This is when she really begins to like him. As well as let out her soft side a bit.
I like how their relationship goes. It's not a luvy-duvy relationship where they're all over each other. It's, at the moment, a casual romance. They're really good friends but... more. On occasion she gets the irrepressible urge to pull him over into a kiss, which is something I always look forward to.
I would like to see them actually explore their relationship a bit more. Focus on each other for an amount of time... but I do like that in everyday life they don't necessarily have to be hanging all over each other, while at the same time feeling those feelings.
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Post by buckmana on Apr 24, 2013 20:13:22 GMT -5
This is something I've been wondering about.
In ancient societies, it was common for marriage to occur at around 15-16, because the average lifespan was around 30 years.
In some cases, you actually begin courting your future bride at around 12 years old, because it would take a long time to actually win her hand! And you're engaged by the time she turns 14 (if you managed to court her successfully).
So, being from an ancient society, Hiccup and Astrid are of an age where they can get married. So why haven't they taken this step yet, considering their romantic relationship is obviously a serious one.
Heather would also be another possible candidate for Hiccup, but given that she's now friends with Astrid, she's not going to go there. Also, Snotlout was very interested in Heather, but at the end of the episode, she gives him a "sorry, but it's not going to happen" look.
Fishlegs I expect would end up with a girl much like himself, a sweet and loving persona, most likely with a passion for book learning.
As for Ruffnut, I can't really see her getting together with anyone, she's a bit strange and nobody would really want to marry an odd girl.
Tuffnut's too much of an idiot to get a girl.
Snotlout is too full of himself, so I bet his first date with any girl is also his last date with said girl.
Also, I find it odd that we don't see any other teenagers in the show or movie. There has to be more then 6 teenagers in the entire village (7 if we count Heather).
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Post by Berk on Apr 24, 2013 21:50:50 GMT -5
Perhaps.
Although, honestly, I'm assuming that the age thing is being set to our normal standards (maybe early 20s/late teens at the most?) for a number of reasons. There are, of course, other inconsistencies. With the level of sanitation in an "Ancient" society (this society is not so much Ancient, by the way, as it would appear to be more Medieval. I'd definately put it at least a few centuries into the AD/CE era) I promise you that the huge number of amputees Berk has wouldn't have survived.
With Hiccup/Astrid/Gang maybe ~5 years older in the sequel, could I see some marriage related stuff begin to pop up? Perhaps so. We'll have to see.
Interesting take on the marriage thing. I'm personally not so sure myself.
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TheCube
Caught Dragon
vi - IVM7 - V - I ...
Posts: 182
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Post by TheCube on Apr 25, 2013 14:35:34 GMT -5
I always thought Hiccstrid was left with a bit of uncertainty in the first movie. Astrid's story in relation to Hiccup's seems more like a development of respect for Hiccup. Her anger at Hiccup as he inadvertently trumps her in dragon training is her trying to deny the fact that Astrid's painstaking training (we've seen her throwing axes in the forest, at least) cannot match whatever Hiccup has done, leading her to "interrogate" him in the Cove. It's much more about trying to find out what Hiccup's been doing than Hiccup himself. Then, she has her own awakening moments, first during the "romantic flight," and second during her discourse with Hiccup after discovering the Den. I like to think of these moments as her realization that Hiccup is doing all this not just for the dragon training but something more. While this certainly makes Astrid sympathetic towards Hiccup, I don't know if all this can lead to an inference of a romantic relationship, especially after a bit of reset that happened in RoB. With Hiccup/Astrid/Gang maybe ~5 years older in the sequel, could I see some marriage related stuff begin to pop up? Perhaps so. We'll have to see. *Duct tapes own mouth* *Duct tapes nose* *explodes*
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Post by Berk on Apr 25, 2013 22:58:25 GMT -5
.... I might need to drive you into exile for a year, you know.
Anyways, I think the "reset" in Riders of Berk is more due to the convenience of it allowing them to develop the romance during the series (which is hampered if it's solidly established already) rather than to a previous lack of it.
Although I do believe there was definately a lot of Astrid gaining respect for Hiccup, I do believe romantic feelings developed too. That moment during the romantic flight where she really just loosens, wraps her arms around him and leans on him is some pretty blatant show of romantic feelings. And of course the kisses. But I think that there was a large sense of the fact that they're beginning to explore this, rather than automatically committing to something, especially with all of the other stuff going on.
The Romance was pretty dead-set blatant to me in HTTYD, honestly. Gift of the Night Fury also had some of these elements too. They're casual... but still a little bit more than friends. And the kiss, while it's not something they do everyday... it definately displays underlying emotion.
I've always appreciated how Astrid has managed to stay tough and yet be romantic. For instance, at the end of the movie, though being extremely romantic with that kiss, there's also the fact that she pulls Hiccup into it. She does that with pretty much every kiss to date, actually, and I appreciate it. In RoB I've noticed that she seems to have lost a little of her signature toughness at times. Maybe it's just because she no longer needs to be as competitive, or because she's more friendly, or what... but in any case, I'm hoping her "toughness" remains evident, yet controlled, in the sequel.'
*Stares at a certain someone*
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Post by buckmana on Apr 26, 2013 6:25:14 GMT -5
The definition of ancient is a broad one here.
As was pointed out, medieval also applies.
I think though, even as late as the 1800s, they still accepted those ages as the correct ones to indulge in courtship.
I saw a show about a ghost girl who was no more then 15 (technically, she's 187) and the boy from the 20th century is shocked to find out she's engaged! Or was when she was alive (bit hard to marry someone who is dead). And she acts like a Victorian era lady, so that's relatively recent by comparison.
I also read about a historical article of a mexican land baron's daughter who had to play the role of his "son" because his only son had died in battle. According to the details, her grandmother was ashamed of her because she was 18 years old and hadn't gotten married. She kept referring to her as "an old maid" and it was too late to get suitors now. Conversely, her 14 year old sister was planning her wedding at this time.
It's only when the relative lifespan of the human race was extended that we pushed back the marriage age.
I assume Astrid and Hiccup are still living in a time where life is likely to be short, so they should be following the 15 year age of marriage rule.
But I doubt many people would understand the difference and would try to apply 21st century values to the age limits.
And yes, I'm in no doubt that Astrid is serious about Hiccup. You don't kiss a boy full on the lips unless you really want him!
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TheCube
Caught Dragon
vi - IVM7 - V - I ...
Posts: 182
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Post by TheCube on Apr 26, 2013 15:03:32 GMT -5
I think the historical period HTTYD is set in is a source not just of reference but also of artistic imagination. Reading about music composition methods, one of the things I learned was that sometimes, a set of rules is the best source of ideas. Rules give you the toolset and the sandbox that an artist can use, while without them you'll have to build the tools and the scene manually. The Celtic-Viking setting gives the creator a set of cool ideas, such as their clothing, geographical features, music, and writing, but they can modify or even extend upon these to create their own world. For the score, Powell builds upon Celtic instruments and modes using conventional western harmony and modulations. Hiccup's inventions are designed with the traditional materials but work in clever, almost steampunk-esque ways. What I meant to convey through all that nonsense is, as an artist DreamWorks doesn't really need to adhere to any specific feature of the time period. We might as well wonder if these Vikings develop a different accent as they grow up. *Stares at a certain someone* *Hides behind the ever-powerful shield of the Interwebz* I'm kinda confused by Hiccstrid because it is Hiccup who "admires" Astrid at first, but it is Astrid who pretty initiates all these things. Is it just Hiccup's inaction?
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Post by Berk on Apr 26, 2013 21:18:46 GMT -5
I mean, yeah, pretty much. This is a fantasy world. And the Vikings seem to live longer than just mid-30s. As I said with regard to lifespan, half of them would be dead if they were adhering to real-world health issues. Look at all those amputees. The amount of life-threatening infections if this was real...
Anyways, it may be partly Hiccup's nervousness/inaction. But, with regards to the movie at least, I think it's pretty much because he's been, well, busy. At the beginning we notice he has a crush on her, but after that he gets a bit busy. The first peck on the cheek? His mind's on the dragon's nest. The second? He's trying to take in this new transformed Berk and the fact that he has one leg.
Perhaps we'll see some more Hiccupian initiative with regards to romance in series/movie future. But as it is Astrid has more of the straightforward takes-what-she-wants attitude than Hiccup's more mellow one.
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Post by buckmana on Apr 27, 2013 1:56:57 GMT -5
I assumed the change in their relationship was due to character development in the movie.
At first, Hiccup believes that becoming a "true viking" will fix all his problems. But when he discovers what kind of person he really is, his priorities shift. At a certain scene in the movie, Hiccup is preparing to leave Berk forever and never return, so I assume he's not interested in forming attachments now, seeing as he's going to be forced to leave. Also, I think Hiccup was growing disgusted with the "vikings must kill dragons" attitude and seeing as that's all he saw in Astrid, he wasn't interested in her anymore.
As for Astrid, initially she comes off as pretty hostile. She's angry at Hiccup for being incompetant and later on, for outscoring her in dragon training. It's only when Toothless intervenes that her aggressive outlook softens and she stops being the ruthless warrior.
So, up until the moment when they both finish their development arcs, it was not possible for them to choose to be a couple, because they weren't compatible up until that moment.
As for the amputees, they did have ways to sterilize the wounds, although they weren't very pleasant. The simplest method was just to heat a frying pan to red hot and then press it to the wound after the limb had been removed. This cauterized the blood vessels and sterilized the area. If their knowledge of natural cures was advanced enough, they'd use sulphur to disinfect injuries.
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Post by Berk on Apr 27, 2013 14:16:19 GMT -5
With that kind of knowledge they'd also know enough to live relatively longer.
Gothi and Mildew both seem rather older than 30 (and I suspect Gothi to be older than Mildew). ....In any case, nobody seems to be courting at 15, so I'm suspecting that nobody is strictly following the anthropological record.
Hiccup is a "true" viking in many ways (and we appear to be seeing this much, much more in the second movie). I think a large part of the movie was realizing that although Hiccup was more of the scrawny-brainy type than the strong and tough type, he still had overall the heart of a Viking. For only a great Viking could take down the Red Death, no?
He does prepare to leave Berk, true... but this is more for the fact that he can't kill a dragon (morally) rather than the fact that he really wants to go. Just because he might have to leave doesn't mean that he doesn't still like Astrid. Also, we'll never know if he was serious. That could have been an initial overreaction. People have those all the time (and yes, to the point of packing). As much as he was abhorred with the actual act of killing dragons, I'm not so sure he was resentful towards the actual vikings. I mean, they didn't know any better, right? They were just defending their homeland.
You do make some interesting points though... who knows, in the end.
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Post by buckmana on Apr 29, 2013 3:53:49 GMT -5
Well, that's the impression I got from that scene, that he realized he couldn't do anything to change the Vikings' opinion on Dragons (there's a subtext in the earlier scene with Stoick about that), so his only option is to leave.
Which is the cause of his resentment, he doesn't want to stay with them anymore.
It's only when Astrid's opinion on the matter shifts and she gives him the hope that there may be another way that he changes his course of action.
And sterilizing wounds is only one factor that limits lifespans. Most people those days died of simple diseases, because they didn't have the necessary knowledge to treat them. For the most part, those treatments weren't discovered until the late 1800s, early 1900s.
A tough individual might endure diseases better, so this could explain why some of the village are significantly older.
Although, have you noticed that Gothi and Mildew are the only real senior members of the village? And they seem pretty tough, which could account for their longevity.
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