|
|
Post by Berk on Feb 20, 2013 20:34:29 GMT -5
This is the discussion thread for the 16th episode of Season 1, entitled "Defiant One".
Discuss.
Personally, I really liked this episode. I think it had a great mixture of plot, character development and of course humor (the return of Snotlout's battle cry).
There was definately some sense of development with Snotlout and his own envy. Even though he continues to be the Thawfest champion we can see that Hiccup's own rise and achievements are getting to him... the dragon training, the Red Death.... (perhaps Astrid...), everything. And how he's trying to deal with that.
It's also intriguing me because this is the second episode in the row they've mentioned the Red Death incident (has it been mentioned before?) which makes me wonder whether "The Legend of Hiccup" is beginning to grow in the Viking world...
And of course besides Snotlout's own flaw (if you call Jealousy that) we also see a bit of Hiccup's own boastfulness come out there in their agument.
But, true to their colors they manage to really work it out and work together to escape, no doubt in large thanks to the work of Snotlout. He has something to be proud of.
And of course there are the little things. I was kind of wondering for a second when the connecting rod broke whether or not it would be feasible for Toothless to use his own firey breath to weld it back together.... apparently not.
I'm kind of wondering now whether Toothless can control the intensity of his blasts... because Savage took one head-on and didn't seem more than a bit dazed, whereas before those things have been shown to do serious damage.
(Also, as a sidenote, in case this ever comes up into Canon discussion, I'm going to say that I think Alvin calling Hiccup "90 pounds" was more of an exaggeration/insult on Alvin's part... besides, how would he possibly know that?)
And of course there were a few funny moments. Toothless eating the bread was priceless. And Snotlout chasing Savage away by just sort of screaming and running at him.
The Ending, with the music and the lighting change and everything I thought was really sweet and sort of the "problem solved" moment.... the thing was though that I had the "Romantic Flight" from the movie stuck in my head because of the lighting so I was cracking up with laughter.
And of course I appreciate the small things like the smile Astrid gives Hiccup.
All in all I think this was a really great episode. Thumbs up in my book.
|
|
|
|
Post by Berk on Feb 20, 2013 20:55:30 GMT -5
Oh, one other thing I wanted to mention..
The Dragons of Outcast Island.
Those things are just violent.
I don't know... the way they always fight with everyone they come across and themselves is just something that strikes me. The "Berk Dragons", even before they were "trained" always seemed to get along with one another, even if they would occasionally fight.
I don't know... maybe it was just because the common Red Death threat meant they couldn't. Maybe they're just all of one flock (though it's interesting that they wouldn't flock by breed). Maybe it's just one group against another (because admittedly I don't know if I've seen the Outcast dragons fight each other). And of course the show has told us that not every dragon is "good".
I don't know... maybe Outcast Island is just so inhospitable and the Outcast so violent against them that they're combatative towards everyone.
Who knows...
|
|
|
|
Post by ravenorus on Feb 20, 2013 21:12:06 GMT -5
I'm kind of wondering now whether Toothless can control the intensity of his blasts... because Savage took one head-on and didn't seem more than a bit dazed, whereas before those things have been shown to do serious damage. This bothered me as well at first, but remember how Toothless gives that terrible terror just a tiny blast in the movie? So I think the change in intensity level is likely. also - That was an awfully strong connection rod for it to be used as a weapon. - Hand signals were back! "Toothless will be acquiring a new power, but it's not known what it is or what episode it'll be featured in." - berksgrapevine.com Do you think that the healing qualities of Toothless's saliva is the new power? I guess I was expecting/hoping for something more... spectacular. -R |
|
|
|
Post by ravenorus on Feb 20, 2013 21:24:03 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by Berk on Feb 20, 2013 21:37:12 GMT -5
I'm debating whether that healing power was something real or whether the swelling went down by itself and Hiccup was just getting a bit of payback.
Who knows.
|
|
|
|
Post by timberjack on Feb 21, 2013 14:51:47 GMT -5
Oh, one other thing I wanted to mention.. The Dragons of Outcast Island. Those things are just violent. I don't know... the way they always fight with everyone they come across and themselves is just something that strikes me. The "Berk Dragons", even before they were "trained" always seemed to get along with one another, even if they would occasionally fight. I don't know... maybe it was just because the common Red Death threat meant they couldn't. Maybe they're just all of one flock (though it's interesting that they wouldn't flock by breed). Maybe it's just one group against another (because admittedly I don't know if I've seen the Outcast dragons fight each other). And of course the show has told us that not every dragon is "good". I don't know... maybe Outcast Island is just so inhospitable and the Outcast so violent against them that they're combatative towards everyone. Who knows... All that those dragons see is violence from the outcasts. It really isn't surprising that they are violent. Berk is a peaceful, normal (ish) society. It's the same as being brought up in a violent or peaceful home. On the episode, it seems that every ep past 13 (when lightning strikes) has a much darker feel to it. Did they change writers or something? |
|
|
|
Post by ravenorus on Feb 21, 2013 15:23:14 GMT -5
On the episode, it seems that every ep past 13 (when lightning strikes) has a much darker feel to it. Did they change writers or something? Yeah I noticed this as well. As far as I know the writers haven't changed, and I think I remember reading somewhere that they always planned to go in this direction at some point. |
|
|
|
Post by timberjack on Feb 21, 2013 16:33:35 GMT -5
On the episode, it seems that every ep past 13 (when lightning strikes) has a much darker feel to it. Did they change writers or something? Yeah I noticed this as well. As far as I know the writers haven't changed, and I think I remember reading somewhere that they always planned to go in this direction at some point. Yeah. I mean look at this screenshot from ep 1:  and then check out the latest episode:  The blacks are darker, the sky is this monotonous grey, and the characters have a noticeably rougher tone to them. |
|
|
|
Post by Berk on Feb 22, 2013 1:45:32 GMT -5
Well, in all fairness, the latter was on outcast Island, and at night... during a storm.
But yeah, it is getting more serious. But that's not a bad thing. They need a mix of both.
|
|
|
|
Post by timberjack on Feb 22, 2013 5:49:46 GMT -5
Well, in all fairness, the latter was on outcast Island, and at night... during a storm. But yeah, it is getting more serious. But that's not a bad thing. They need a mix of both. True, but I could chose any slide from the last three and they would all look pretty much the same. Don't get me wrong, I am really liking this change. But i'm surprised a cartoon network show is taking a much more dark turn than usual. |
|
varthikes
Not Quite...
Dragons cannot be controlled; their trust must be earned
Posts: 23
|
Post by varthikes on Feb 24, 2013 1:12:06 GMT -5
I really enjoyed this episode, too. I really loved seeing Toothless thinking through a situation on his own. We saw a little bit of that in previous episodes, namely "Animal House" and "What Flies Beneath". With the latter it was more of a negative inclination. Here, I could see his mind working. Loved the look he gives Snotlout when the latter considers taking Toothless for himself.
I guess it was just a matter of time before we got a bathroom joke: "Why didn't you go before we left?"
Also, I have to comment on Alvin. Mark Hamill does terrific voice work here. Not once do I hear a Viking-sounding Luke Skywalker.
|
|
|
|
Post by barracuda on Feb 26, 2013 1:16:27 GMT -5
- That was an awfully strong connection rod for it to be used as a weapon. Yeah, that was really weird. Snotlout just bends it a little and it breaks, then they use it like Excalibur after being reforged? Must've been a magical Outcast forge... ;D They could've used all the weapons laying around in the forge and from the defeated vikings... but nothing beats the power of a dragon harness connection rod! |
|
|
|
Post by sairen on Feb 26, 2013 3:28:47 GMT -5
The Connecting Rod was another piece Hiccup found in the Outcast Forge. That...looked like a connecting rod and really not sure what that sort of thing is used for. Presumably Hiccup did have to work it to be the right length. But it does make sense it'd be stronger. Whatever they're using a connecting rod for, it's not going to be built for something of speed.
Remember, Hiccup's been making a lighter and lighter connecting rod throughout the season. In the Heather episodes and during Thawfest, which would make it so the rod is weaker.
It seems like species doesn't matter much for dragon flocks. The Berk dragons are all different species and we've seen the dragons around Outcast Island are also different species. We've yet to see any flock of the same species, only solitary dragons. It may be they flock together between breeds as a sort of way to combine forces. Dragons have different strengths and weaknesses, it'd be to their advantage to have an arsenal. Especially if they're a flock that deals with humans. If they were just one type, any aggressive humans may wipe them out.
Which does make it odd that they attacked Toothless, but it could be because of how bad Outcast Island is. There's not a lot of food around, and the dragons may just be more concerned about their flock and suddenly having a new dragon around was a threat to already limited resources. It would also explain why they allowed the gang around Outcast Island before, because they brought food. It doesn't seem they're wholly aggressive, they attack quick, but they're also quick to back off and calm down. Astrid made friends with a Monstrous Nightmare and the one in the Defiant One calmed down when Hiccup got involved. So it doesn't seem to be a 'RAWR, I WILL DESTROY ALL' sort of attack, but something that's more along the lines of territorial. When they see a sign of peace, they calm down. Until then, intimidate.
|
|
|
|
Post by Berk on Feb 27, 2013 20:00:03 GMT -5
One thing you brought up-- perhaps by accident, actually piques my interest.
Are these different dragons breeds or species?
Under the formal definition, species are groups which can only breed in their group, and can't breed with others (with a few exceptions) (for example, a llama cannot breed with a frog).
However, breeds are subcategories of species which can interbreed (for instance, Collies and Beagles are different dog breeds, but they are both dogs, and can breed to make a collie-beagle mix).
So I'm curious. Because if they're breeds then we could see, for instance, a Monstrous Nightmare-Whispering Death hybrid ("mutt"), or a Gronkle-Zippleback hybrid ("mutt"), or a Nadder-Night Fury mix, or something like that.
Potentially, at least. And we haven't seen any yet. So I'm wondering if it's just because we haven't seen it... or if it's because it's not possible.
Hm... we'll have to see.
|
|
|
|
Post by sairen on Feb 28, 2013 2:15:15 GMT -5
Total accident.
I have no idea. I don't think they ever addressed it in the books either. There was cross-dragon-type ROMANCE, but no real hybrids that I can remember from the first eight books.
Maybe dragons are more like fish or reptile categories. It certainly seems that way in the books, with how many types there are and beyond just the normal wing and scales that breathe fire definitions.
|
|
